Topic: The perfect program

[Touti]

A software may not be suitable for one's needs but it doesn't make it garbage automatically

There has been many complaints at IVS over the years that the program only allows you to see the what's in your local database.  When you click on an actor name it only shows the movies that you own.

If your collection is stored online, it can be part of the main database, views that link YOUR data with everyone's data can be created.  Having your collection as part as the main database offers endless possibilities of reporting, inquiries, pattern searching etc.  This cannot be easily achieved if one database is on your PC and the other one is on a server.

Those who don't personalize data and always keep their profiles in sync with the online DB would no longer have to download updates, they could be "live" and automatically see any updates to a profile show up in their data.

As far as servers being down, good server configuration with failovers take care of that.  If a dba knows what he's doing, a server should never be down for maintenance of unavalaible because of a crash.

Of course, if your internet connection is down you won't have access to your database but how often does that happen ?

[Achim]

I would still like to have my own data locally, just like Ross. Making the move to an "entirely" online based collection would depend on the features offered. Admittedly, the one you just mentioned regarding crosslinking over ALL profiles in the main database is pretty cool.

But couldn't that be achieved with some kind of "online collection" as we have it now yet keep the program local...? Or having the data local yes some functionality requiring to have data being retrieved from the net?

I also like being in control of "my data". So you mentioning that it could be "live" has me somewhat concerned...

[Edward Karlinski]

A program that is only available online is garbage. It is not even really a program, it is an internet service. I want a database program, not an internet service. I want something which I can customize on my computer.

[Touti]

What I mean by "Live" is that you could opt to have every contribution automatically posted in your collection.  No more downloads.......ever.

There is a few problem with cross-linking over the net.  

First: Bandwidth, it would be tremendous because when a view is compiled before being presented to the client, ALL data must be available so a good chunk of your local db would have to be sent over to the server for the links to be established.

Speed: Because of the amount of data going back and forth on the line, it would be extremely slow.

Maintenance:  It is practically impossible to create new views or cross-link until EVERYONE has the same version.  If a new field is added to version 2 and a view that link this field between profiles is created on the server.  It obviously can't work unless the field is also present in the local db or it will generate an error.  It is possible to work around that but it becomes extremely complicated.

There is also many advantages of online database.  You could have the program running on as many PC's as you want and have access to your collection without ever having to copy it from one pc to another.  

There could be stuff in the system that would allow you to grant access (either readonly or read&write) to your collection.

If there is a contributor that you trust 100%, you could have all hist contributions posted to your collection REGARDLESS of wether they are accepted in the master DB or not.

[Touti]

A program that is only available online is garbage. It is not even really a program, it is an internet service. I want a database program, not an internet service. I want something which I can customize on my computer.

Edward I never said anything about a program that is only available online.  The program is real and running on your PC.  I'm talking about Data stored online as opposed to locally.  You would still be able to personalize your data any way you want.  I'm not suggesting that you are forced to use the online profile, I'm only talking about YOUR data being stored online instead of locally.

And again, because something doesn't suit your particular needs or tastes doesn't make it garbage.

[RossRoy]

You bring good points Touti for it to be live, and that's fine. I like the idea.

But like I said, what happens if the server goes down, indefinitely? Be it for lack of funds because of bandwidth, or lack of interest of the managers? I realise this is looking LONG term, but I really don't want to go through it all over again.

When I made the switch from DVDAf to DVDP, I only had about 250 DVD to fill in, and I still was pissed at doing it, but at least it was a decision I made. Today, I'd have ~1400 to reenter into a new solution. I don't exactly want to do that. As long as I have a way to download and access the data in some way locally (even if it's just an XML file I can load into Excel or Access), I'd be happy. I'm just scared of live solutions because of the possibility of losing it ALL. But as long as there's a way to download and store my data locally, I'm fine with a completely LIVE solution.

[m.cellophane]

I'm occasionally out of range of the internet for a few days at a time. During those trips, I enjoy having my collection on my laptop. I like online features but only as an extension of fully customizable local data. 

[Edward Karlinski]

Well, I misunderstood your suggestion, Touti. By the way, because you like something does not ,make it not garbage. I still cannot support the idea of such a program online. I just see too many problems that can occur. One thing I liked about DVD Profiler is that I was able to maintain my collection when the online site was down during the legal dispute. I don't see th need to have more utility online. The programming effort could be better used on the actual database program.

[Touti]

RossRoy:  One of the things I have planned, if I ever finish this of course , is that in the event that I have to shut everything down.  The entire online DB would be downloadable to become your local DB.  Source code and full XML and CSV export would also be available so anyone would be able to easily switch to another program.

M. Cellophane: What about fully customizable online data .  You'd still have your own data, the only difference is that your database would be online instead of being local.

I guess I have the answer to my question however. None of you seem to prefer losing some features and keep their database locally which, in the case of DVDP if I may remind everyone, was totally useless to you when Invelos' servers were down

[Touti]

I just want to bring a precision to my last statement.  As Edward mentioned, when Invelos' server was down, you could still maintain your collection.  What I meant is that having local data as opposed to online data was no advantage if the business had gone down because the XML export was incomplete (as I recall), there was no .CSV and the data files are password protected so, having it local did not in any way guarantee that we would have been able to convert our collections to anything else.

[m.cellophane]

M. Cellophane: What about fully customizable online data .  You'd still have your own data, the only difference is that your database would be online instead of being local.

Well, it wouldn't work for me when I'm at my father-in-law's, where I am not on the internet during my stay. That's why I like having my local collection.

I guess I have the answer to my question however. None of you seem to prefer losing some features and keep their database locally which, in the case of DVDP if I may remind everyone, was totally useless to you when Invelos' servers were down

When Invelos was down, I was fine. I can do my own scans and frequently do my own cast and crew. Their updates are  sort of low on my priority list.

I've just seen your clarification. However, now we have full export capabilities via XML and CSV; right? So if they disappear right now, I can still export and move to a different program. I'm not really sure because I don't investigate that area much.

[Touti]

Well, it wouldn't work for me when I'm at my father-in-law's, where I am not on the internet during my stay. That's why I like having my local collection.

I didn't think of that......good point.

[RossRoy]

As Edward mentioned, when Invelos' server was down, you could still maintain your collection.

Well, that's 3/4 true.

You could still maintain what you already had, and could add new ones, as long as you already had the OnlineList.dod file. If you didn't have that file, then you couldn't even get in the add dvd dialog.

So DVD Profiler is still useful offline, to a certain extent

[m.cellophane]

You could still maintain what you already had, and could add new ones, as long as you already had the OnlineList.dod file. If you didn't have that file, then you couldn't even get in the add dvd dialog.

I think Achim made that file available to folks who were without it, as I recall.  Friends helping friends.

[richierich]

I have always wanted a more flexible numbering and local sort field, and for it to be alphanumeric. Because of how I sort my collection, I still need to maintain an excel spreadsheet to find titles, and DVDP does not allow C364 for example to be input as a location.