Topic: 2011 election disaster

[Jimmy]

I know politic is off-limit but it's canadian politic so no real controversy here....

Am I the only Canadians here to be shock by the results today? Seriously I don't understand at all, even as a theorical point of view that doesn't make sense...

First be prepare the Reform Party will be back tomorrow... The Tories/Reform fusion was always a joke, they aren't a minority governement anymore. So the door will be fully open to the religious rights : abortion will be criminalize again, 14 years old will go in adult prison, the corporation will pay even less taxes and will get a ton of subventions, the preservation of the environment is over, the forest industry is dead for good and our province will loose most of its acquired rights. To resume simply : tomorrow the canadian idealism will start dying welcome to Canada/USA

secondly, what the hell happen to the French Canadian did they loose all their common sense in a week? Do they really thing a bunch of unknown deputy with no experience (even me I have more political experience than most of them) will be able to defend our province against the attack of the Reform Party? Where is the common sense when you vote for someone you don't know and never heard of? Seriously it's like if Le party Québec Solidaire would win the next provincial election... that doesn't make sense. What the point of jumping in a bandwagon for crying out loud? Fuck this isn't American Idol, but real life. Do people realized the future consequences of this? I guess not...

The partial results (or end result depending of the hour you will read that)

[RossRoy]

I've written many different posts, only to delete them.

I'll just say this:

I personally don't think this is a disaster at all. The disparition of the Bloc couldn't come soon enough. The rise of the Conservatives is a bit unnerving, yet I much prefer this to NDP, or even the Liberals, taking over.

We'll see what they do with that majority. As of now, I'm more than willing to give them a chance.

[Jimmy]

It's a 4 years minimum chance, in politic this is long and now the Reform Party had a non-experienced opposition in front of them. Yes I'm a nationalist I'm proud to have fought for my country since 25 years, so the complete shutout of the Bloc Quebecois shock me and frighten me for the years to come. But with that said I would have taken the Liberal Party as the oposition, even if I will always hate them for what they did to us, at least they were experienced and able to control the Reform Party....

Remember the disater that happen the last time the French Canadian jumped in a bandwagon? The ADQ was the oposition, it was a joke and the Liberal Party was able to do everything they wanted to do.... Now imagine the same experience but 100 times worst

I haven't be depressed like that since the day Meech was rejected

I've written many different posts, only to delete them.

Stop deleting them
Do like me and sound like a ranting guy

[RossRoy]

I'll admit from reading what you just written that I am much less "politicized" than you are. To be honest with you, all this doesn't really interest me much at all. To me, it's pretty all the same.

Change one crook for another crook, what do you get? A crook.

Like I said, we'll see what happens.

[Kathy]

All I know is that if Donald Trump becomes president, I need to find a new country! 

I don't know enough about the particulars to comment intelligently on your post Jimmy. But, I'll hope for the best for your country.

[Jimmy]

Except for the Alberta I'm sure everybody here will see a really tough four years. The only thing I will be able to say to the complainers in those years will be that I didn't vote for the Reform Party or the NPD...

I can't even thing at a comparaison since nothing like that as ever happen here in our country... The oil cowboys and the religious rights is in power, sadly it wasn't a dream.

[hal9g]

Change one crook for another crook, what do you get? A crook.

This, unfortunately is the reality we all face.  They are all in it for themselves, their buddies and to maintain their own power.  They don't give a rat's ass about the common man or the long term future of their country (this is not directed at Canadian politicians, but ALL politicians)!

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Change one crook for another crook, what do you get? A crook.

This, unfortunately is the reality we all face.  They are all in it for themselves, their buddies and to maintain their own power.  They don't give a rat's ass about the common man or the long term future of their country (this is not directed at Canadian politicians, but ALL politicians)!

Correct,
and how did this happen?
Voters usually don't appreciate to be told the naked truth, so they vote for the guy that hides best what he's actually going to do. And if this is the guy with the better optics the election is a safe bet.
As long as politicians are confronted with impeachments for otherwise completely private affairs (e.g. extra-marital sex) or even have to publicly prove that they are born in a certain country you will only very hardly find the best to do that job. You will get those stubborn crooks that don't care if their private lives get turned inside-out as long as they get enough money back.

If the moral "standards" applied for becoming a politician would be applied in "normal" life, half the world would immediately lose their jobs, and the other half would have to go about half a week later for blatantly lying.

[hal9g]

Correct,
and how did this happen?

Well, it's been going on for decades in this country as people have slowly perverted the purpose of government and created a society that has become dependent upon it.  We have done it to ourselves!

[Jimmy]

You know the more I think about this result the most one of my dream seem to be possible, I think Sebastien will understand what is this dream...

The Canada will be a mess, we will see that finally the federation isn't viable and we will see how the French Canadian aren't respected in it (even if we are the one who built and has discovered this country). In two years the same thing will happen with our provincial governement and the nationalist movement with a strong leader will be back in force in the Province where it is supposed to be.

This is my last post about this because it's a mined field and I don't want to hurt our Canadian members with our fight who isn't against them but for us.

[RossRoy]

You know the more I think about this result the most one of my dream seem to be possible, I think Sebastien will understand what is this dream...

I think anybody in Canada will know what this dream or yours is. Can't say I agree with it, but I won't get into this discussion. I don't feel strongly enough one way or another to actually form a valid opinion.

[Blair]

Where I get so frustrated is the discussion of the difference in the parties' values/agendas or whatever you want to call them and the belief that there is only one right answer.

None of us knows anyone wasn't alive 200 years ago and unless you were don't know how things worked back then (you can only read what others say happened, but whoever writes the history controls the history). Even stories passed down within families change over time. I don't know if mud-slinging was as common as it is today, and I don't know what sort of values they had back then (ie: the ever-ready debate as to whether my countries founding fathers used a strict interpretation between "church and state" or if they really did pray before meetings (as one example). However, the different parties were created because there are people in mine and any country that believes in those individual sets of values else every election would be a 99% landslide.

One of the main issues for "the people" is that when one of heavily influenced by the values of a single party, they can't accept that values of the other party are just as legitimate, and in a day where everything said by anyone of importance is at your fingertips, and they themselves are acting in the same "everyone should follow me because your ideas are stupid" way it only influences the people more to divide.

[KinkyCyborg]

I'm mostly glad that it is a majority government so we won't have to vote again in another year and a half. Four elections in the past 7 years is a ridiculous waste of taxpayer money. I'm also ecstatic at the disintegration of the Bloc as a party whose mandate is to separate from the country has no business making decisions in Ottawa. If they want to confine themselves to provincial politics...fine. Disband? Even better!

[hal9g]

One of the main issues for "the people" is that when one of heavily influenced by the values of a single party, they can't accept that values of the other party are just as legitimate, and in a day where everything said by anyone of importance is at your fingertips, and they themselves are acting in the same "everyone should follow me because your ideas are stupid" way it only influences the people more to divide.

What drives me crazy is the incredible hypocrisy.

Republicans today are wailing about raising the debt ceiling, but had no problem doing it when Bush was President.

Three years ago leaders of the Democrat Party were railing President Bush over the cost of gasoline (which was about $3.00/gallon at the time).  Today, that same Democrat Party not only is not railing the current President about high gasoline prices (now at $4.00/gallon) but is actually floating reasons why gas prices at this level are a good thing, e.g., forcing people to drive less, forcing companies to seriously pursue "green" energy solutions, etc.

What the hell difference does it make whose sitting in the White House?

This is why I say, all politicians are only interested in serving themselves and maintaining their own power, and the hell with the rest of us!

[Jimmy]

I'm also ecstatic at the disintegration of the Bloc as a party whose mandate is to separate from the country.

Kevin contrary to what's Steven Harper and Jean Chretien before him like to repeat over and over it was never the party raison d'être. The party was formed to defend the French Canadian interest in the Canada after the slap in the face the rest of the Canada gave us with the rejection of the Meech Lake agreement (Lucien Bouchard was not even a nationalist at that time). There was nothing bad in that as there was nothing bad when the Reform party was formed to defend the interest of the Province of Alberta (it was a regional party too before the masquerade that is the fusion with the Conservative party). It isn't their mandate and it never was, repeated a falsehood over and over don't make the untruthfulness truthfulness. This is just the kind of half truth that is repeated frequently in the english part of the country because it's an easy button to push...

Four elections in the past 7 years is a ridiculous waste of taxpayer money.

Something that wouldn't happen if Harper would have been able to cooperate with the 3 others parties. Most of the countries of the world are able to exist with political coalitions and more often than not in a better way than here. Why? Because they have learned to cooperate and share the power in the best interest of the citizens and not the interest of a party or a minority. Also for me overthrow a government because of its lack of respect for the Parlement (which is like lying and disrespecting the canadian population) isn't a waste of money. It's the reason why the government was overthrown and not because of the budget, contrary to what Harper said during the campaign no vote was made on the budget since this vote would have happen after the confidence motion vote presented by the Liberal party and the government has lost the confidence of the Parlement with it. So there was no government after it and by consequent no budget.