Topic: Anyone Here Own A Kindle?

[RossRoy]

pdf: Portable data file (or is it portable document file ??)

Since you ask, I've always known it as "Portable Document Format" - and as far as I know, it was created for the printing industry to try and standardize everything. Because back then, different platforms and design softwares meant the print company had to have the same platform and software combination to be able to print the job correctly.

That being, I'm not too big of a fan of digital books, mostly because of DRM. I love going to second hand book shops and browse through. I found some real gems in those places. Digital will just kill it, especially with DRM.

I had a Palm device many years ago (don't even remember what model it was hahaha), it was useful for reading on the bus, but that's it. I really didn't like it for reading at night. I much prefer the good old books.

There's just something about real books. Is it the smell? Is it something else? I don't know. There's just something almost magical about all that paper. I just don't enjoy it as much electronically.

Although I must say, the Kindle seems really interesting, and almost got me to buy it a few months ago.

[Touti]

I had a Palm device many years ago (don't even remember what model it was hahaha), it was useful for reading on the bus, but that's it. I really didn't like it for reading at night. I much prefer the good old books.

I've read/heard that many times but the two can't be compared.  Many people think and eBook reader is any device that can read digital books but that isn't quite true.  A true eBook reader is a device that has an E Ink screen.  There's a huge difference between LCD and E Ink.

I like reading with my Sony PRS-300 and since Sears messed up I ended up getting it for free   I'm thinking about buying the bigger PRS-600 with touch screen but before I got the 300 I tried many times to read with my PDA and I hated it.

I see three major differences.  First, it doesn't take long for the eyes to get tired with LCD's back lights while an E Ink screen is just like a piece of paper.  Second, there's is no reflection on E Ink screens so you don't have to read in the dark and you can hold your device any way you want.  Finally there's the size of the screen, most older PDA's had a very small screen compared to the 5" screen on a PRS-300, and I think the ratio is a bit different.  I'm not sure but mine feels like it's wider for its height than my PDA is.

I also think that eBook readers are good for the environment.  I know many people disagree with me on this and feel that cutting trees to produce paper is good for the forest but I still feel that overall it's detrimental to the environment when you factor in all the fuel that is burnt to transport the trees, produce the kraft paper, transport it, produce paper, transport it, print books, newspapers or magazines, transport them, picking them up in the recycling bin at your door, transporting them, recycling them to make kraft paper and start the cycle all over again.  Cutting trees may be healthy for a forest but the print industry isn't green.

Of course there's also a few things that bother me.

-Most books aren't available in french in their eBook version.

-eBooks tend to be expensive.  Kindle books are quite cheap but when you buy elsewhere they're expensive.  I just compared "The Da Vinci Code" between Amazon.ca and Sony's ebook store.  It's under 8.99$ at Amazon and 13.89$ at Sony.  French books are even more ridiculously expensive, they're often sold the same price as the hard cover printed version of even a few dollars more, that's over twice the price of the pocket size printed one.  That's a real f...in' joke.  Why would I pay 23$ for a book that I can't give to anyone after when the printed ones would cost me 20$ for full size or 12$ for the pocket size.

- The technology should allow to transfer my book to someone else.  It would void it in my reader and put something in the file allowing the device to which I transferred it to re-activate for 30% of the price.......or something like it.  My point is that if that the technology will die if people feel they're being ripped.  That's actually why Kindle is so popular in my opinion, books are cheaper than printed ones.   maybe I should buy a Kindle after all

[Alien Redrum]

My friend just sent me this article, and it's timely to this thread (I think):

Mass Paperback Publisher Goes All Digital

As digital books continue to gain market share, one of the country's oldest mass paperback publishers is abandoning its traditional print books and making its titles available in digital format and print-on-demand only.

Dorchester Publishing Inc., a closely held book and magazine house, said it is making the switch after its book unit sales fell 25% last year, in part because of declining orders from some of its key retail accounts, including Wal-Mart Stores Inc. A spokeswoman for Wal-Mart declined comment.

"It wasn't a long, drawn out decision, because we've been putting in the effort but not getting the results," said Dorchester Chief Executive John Prebich.

The move comes at a time when electronic-book sales are gaining popularity with readers. Mike Shatzkin, chief executive of the Idea Logical Co., publishing consultants, predicts that digital books will be 20% to 25% of unit sales by the end of 2012, up from around 8% today.

The decision to go digital could be a sign of things to come for other small publishers facing declining sales in their traditional print business. Dorchester's switch will likely result in significant savings at a time when it expects its digital sales to double in 2011.

Dorchester, which has been publishing mass market paperbacks since 1971, publishes 25 to 30 new titles a month, approximately 65% of which are romance works. The company launched its first mass paperback titles in 1971.

Romance fans in particular have already embraced e-books, in part because customers can read them in public without having to display the covers. In addition, type size is easily adjusted on e-readers, making titles published in the mass paperback format easier to read for older customers.

Mr. Prebich estimated that 83% of the books published by Dorchester are priced at $7.99. By comparison, the larger trade paperback format is typically priced at about $14.95.

Dorchester's switch to e-books is effective Monday. It plans to make new titles available on a print-on-demand basis through retailers later this year. Ingram Publisher Services, a unit of closely held Ingram Industries Inc., says it will ship orders to retailers as demand arises. News of Dorchester's decision was first reported by Publishers Weekly.

Some authors, Mr. Prebich conceded, may be unhappy if their titles are available only via e-books and print-on-demand, but he said that so far the response has "been receptive to what we're doing."

Hard Case Crime, an imprint owned by closely held Winterfall LLC, said it may seek to move its mystery books from Dorchester to another publishing house.

"It's been a good run, but if they aren't publishing mass market paperbacks, we'll have to decide what to do. I'm a believer in the mass format, but I do understand the reality of the marketplace," said Charles Ardai, who owns Hard Case Crime.

The country's largest consumer book publisher, Bertelsmann AG's Random House Inc., said it continues to be a strong believer in mass paperbacks. One of the country's most successful mystery writers, the late John D. MacDonald, is available from Random House exclusively in mass paperback.

"It's still a viable, popular, lower-priced alternative to the other reading formats," said Stuart Applebaum, a spokesman for Random House. "It also has a committed readership. Will that commitment be forever in a transformative marketplace? We'll have to wait and see."

I'm a member of their Hard Case Crime club, and they publish a lot of horror authors I like, so this is big news for me. It's bittersweet, since I love the paperback versions of the HCC collection, however, I can dig the horror authors going to ebook.

That said, I think the future is going this way. Last Christmas, for the first time ever, Amazon sold more ebooks than hardbacks. I don't think it will happen overnight, or even in the next decade, but I think the article is spot on that more and more small publishers will go this route.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703309704575413611289773690.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

[RossRoy]

I had a Palm device many years ago (don't even remember what model it was hahaha), it was useful for reading on the bus, but that's it. I really didn't like it for reading at night. I much prefer the good old books.

I've read/heard that many times but the two can't be compared.  Many people think and eBook reader is any device that can read digital books but that isn't quite true.  A true eBook reader is a device that has an E Ink screen.  There's a huge difference between LCD and E Ink.

Oh I know actually ebook readers can't really compare to PDA - what I was comparing is the act of reading on a digital device versus actual paper.

IMO, the "green" aspect of it is moot. If anybody is dumb enough to throw away and/or recycle a perfectly good book, they shouldn't have bought the book in the first place! There's so many ways you can pass an old book to someone else.. be it online exchange, dump site, charity, library, used book store, etc. There's not a single valid reason to recycle or throw away a book.

That being said.. I must admit that everytime I go to Amazon and see that big Kindle ad - I'm always on the verge of getting one. But like you said, french books are a rip off (though in my case it's not much of a problem - I read them in english if the original is in english).

But the main drawback to me about the ebook readers really is lending books. Usually, in my family, every single book will be read first by my mom, then my sister, then it comes to me, and then my mom usually reads it again, and then it goes on shelves. But don't worry, it doesn't only stay on the shelf, my mom lends her books to many people, and she likes to reread stuff all the time. So electronic books are not an option here, unless they are DRM free.

[Alien Redrum]

If I'm not mistaken, the Nook has an option where you can 'lend' books to friends and it expires after 15 days or something.

I don't know about the Kindle or Sony, though.

[RossRoy]

If I'm not mistaken, the Nook has an option where you can 'lend' books to friends and it expires after 15 days or something.

15 days? I'd need quite a few "lends" to get through the book! (yeah I'm a slow reader)

[Touti]

IMO, the "green" aspect of it is moot. If anybody is dumb enough to throw away and/or recycle a perfectly good book, they shouldn't have bought the book in the first place! There's so many ways you can pass an old book to someone else.. be it online exchange, dump site, charity, library, used book store, etc. There's not a single valid reason to recycle or throw away a book.

Then I guess I'm dumb .  I do throw books away for recycle and the only reason is that nobody wants them.  I admit that I never thought of used book stores but I called schools and public libraries to offer them.  I was always told to bring it so they can choose what they're interested in.  I don't think so, I'm gonna waste time taking books at to a library and wait there only to be told at the end to take them back with me.

That being said.. I must admit that everytime I go to Amazon and see that big Kindle ad - I'm always on the verge of getting one. But like you said, french books are a rip off (though in my case it's not much of a problem - I read them in english if the original is in english).

I don't read English books, I don't like it, it's not natural to me and it takes away all the pleasure.  I always watch movies in their original language but books I can't.  As for Amazon, it's very easy for me not to buy a Kindle because I've decided to put them on my boycott list until their french site is no longer in english  

But the main drawback to me about the ebook readers really is lending books. Usually, in my family, every single book will be read first by my mom, then my sister, then it comes to me, and then my mom usually reads it again, and then it goes on shelves. But don't worry, it doesn't only stay on the shelf, my mom lends her books to many people, and she likes to reread stuff all the time. So electronic books are not an option here, unless they are DRM free.

We all find this annoying but I can also understand their view on this.  Although a printed book can be lend and passed on from people to people, the number of people who will read a given copy it still somewhat limited.  If ebooks weren't protected they would become easily available everywhere on internet and they would only sell thousands instead of millions.

As for the prices of french ebooks, I'm sorry but it's a fucking joke.  I was checking on jelis.ca a few minutes ago just for fun.  "Sous Surveillance" from Crystine Brouillette (a well know author here in Quebec) is 21.49 on sale when Archambault sells the printed copy for 24.95$.  That's ridiculous, the ebook version cost them nothing compared to the printed one.  

The ebook version should be a lot cheaper because there's hardly any cost in producing it. My question is who puts the extra money in their pocket ?  I'll bet you anything that the author gets the same amount whether I buy the printed one of the ebook one.  The extra 10$-15$ profit on the ebook goes to the distributor and the editor.

[Touti]

I was just reading an article published in France in September 2009. The author is complaining about the price of ebooks, in France the VAT is 19.6% but for books it's only 5.5%.  According to this article however, eBooks aren't considered books so they don't have that special tax rate.  On average an eBook costs 14.1% more than the printed copy because of that.

Stupid.

[Achim]

The only books I have read in the past 10 years were the 7 Harry Potter books and about half of the Hitchhiker's Guide series.

I have the capability to copy any epub file into the iBook reader in my iPhone (or later iPad). Not planning to get back into reading that much. But it's nice to have some of those public domain classics in there (like Bram Stoker's Dracula, Moby Dick, A Christmas Carol, etc.), just in case...

If I should get an iPad, I might use it with comics though, like Kick-Ass on the go, or the The Walking Dead series.

[Dragonfire]

Ok...stupid question here.  I know nothing about these reader things and haven't really thought about getting one.

Anyway..
The different ones - like Kindle, Sony, etc - all use different formats?  So like if I got a Sony one someday, I couldn't get the ebooks from Amazon or Barnes & Noble?

It's not the readers Marie, it's the books that come in different formats.  For any given book you need a reader that can read this format.

Let me see if I can explain this clearly (assuming of course that I know what I'm talking about ).  First lets talk about the formats, there's 2 large categories, open (or public) and proprietary. Open is a format that doesn't belong to anybody and that anyone can use without having to pay a license to anyone.  The most popular formats for ebooks, in no particular order, are:

doc: Windows word files
mobi: Mobipocket.  Proprietary format owned by Amazon since they bought the company that created it.
txt: Text files
epub: Electronic publication (Open format)
pdf: Portable data file (or is it portable document file ??)
bbeb: Sony's proprietary format
azw: Amazon's proprietary

Now some of those formats only come in unsecured files, these are files that don't contain any DRM protection.  They can be copied and shared without limitations.  Files in other formats can be unsecured or secured.  An unsecured ePub, mobi or pdf file can be opened in any ebook reader (let's call it eReader for simplicity) that supports the format. 

Secured (or DRM protected) files however can only be opened in the eReader for which they were purchased.  When I buy a book from Sony's ebook store, it has to be activated for a specific device before it can be opened and once I've done that, it will only work on that device.   So unlike printed books, DRM protected ebooks cannot be passed along to friends and family once you're finished reading them.

Now that we got that cover, we can talk about the eReaders.  Most of them will support the most used unsecured and secured open formats along with their own proprietary format if the manufacturer has one.  The only exception I know of is the Kindle which does not support ePub when almost every other brand does.  The licenses on proprietary formats are made in such ways that 2 of them can't be supported at the same time in a eReader.

Note that Sony decided to stop using their BBeB format, all the books sold on their ebook stores are now in ePub format.

Ok.  Thanks for the explanation.  I understand it a bit better now.

I don't know..I know it would save on storage and all that, but I like my physical books.  Reading off a screen wouldn't be the same I don't think.
Though maybe I'll get one some day.

[Touti]

In case anyone is interested since we're talking about it.  Archambault.ca has the Sony readers on sale, very good price.

http://www.archambault.ca/qmi/catalog/category.jsp?navAction=jump&lang=en&id=cat790024&

[RossRoy]

Just saw this today, thought it fit this thread well


Source: http://techcrunch.com/2010/08/21/just-imagine-what-this-will-look-like-to-your-kids/